So true, he must look at how many mates he lost fighting fascism, only for it to be surging across Europe and the U.K. again, and wonder why they bothered. But thank god for all of us that they did. A mate of mines Dad is a ww2 veteran and I know my mate is glad he can’t see how things are as he is suffering dementia. He says it would have killed him to see all the good his generation did - the NHS, social care, housing etc in the state it is now. He was a ‘tanker’ and mate has some amazing pics of him. He lost a good few mates as they were bullet magnets on the battlefield. He came over from India to fight. Lovely chap.
Indeed; my late father-in-law was a Royal Marine during WW2, serving on HMS Rodney when it engaged & sunk the Bismarck. God only knows what he'd say about the state of the country now, but we are only free to make those comments because of their sacrifices. Boils my piss when I see the likes of Starmer, Johnson et al standing at the Cenotaph when you think how they have betrayed the veterans' legacy. They should be ashamed of themselves but I don't think any of them know what shame is.
I think it's pernicious for any of us, especially media & politicians, to speculate on the meaning behind Alec's words especially when used to support their own views. After all his reasoning could just as easily be this very corruption & selfishness of opinions in a social media hyped modern society.
Well I have met and spoken to hundreds of WW2 veterans and never known one to wish Hitler had won, or that the fight against Hitler was a poor choice. What I have found is so many veterans who feel cheated on the ‘land fit for heroes’ promise, they don’t want hatred and division, they wanted a better world for their kids and grandkids. I have met guys who were tortured within an inch of the life as POWs in Japanese camps and now have friends in Japan as they value reconciliation over revenge. I have had the pleasure to meet and talk to so many and what I have never come across is hatred. We owe them a massive debt and it remains unpaid. But the irony of saying ‘don’t speculate’ then promptly speculating under a guise of ‘possibility’ to attempt to twist a view is not lost on me. After all, who isn’t glad we defeated the Nazis? Who isn’t worried by the rise of extremist far right groups who see Hitler as Hero? Who isn’t against those who wear Helly Hanson kit as it says HH on it in a perverse salute to Hitler? Well to quote someone (as it is a quotes thread after all) ‘if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck………
Yes I did speculate as to what may have been thought and again, yes it was purposely tongue in cheek with irony. However what the suggestion wasn’t, was an assertive assumption as to what must have been thought. There was certainly no attempt to twist a view but only to criticise that such an assumption can or should be made. It is still possible to (always) find it disagreeable to assume what any one must be thinking even when agreeing with the content of the opinion the assumption is been used to validate. These are two separate views that shouldn’t be conflated. Dislike of the former doesn’t imply a dislike of the latter.
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man. One of Shaw’s
