True, but while the Supersport bikes are so technically different to road bikes and people like Kawasaki already making a 600 just for that class, I see no reason why they won't have a road middleweight again. I wonder how well the GSXR750 sells? (Iz a gixxer innit mate, aye!)
Should think so too... the R1 and the H2 are both dazzling and expensive technical tour-de-forces, but the Scrambler's actually fun, real-world, quite cool... and loveable. They're ace!
I must be alone then in thinking the Scrambler is one of the most disappointing bikes I've ridden. Throttle snatchy, cheap hand controls, hard seat...
So what makes the 'bike of the year' best ride, best value, most technology, biggest leap forward in progress Clearly none of them then
horses for coarse;s init, apart from obvious advertiser pressures, one day my fugly will be the best thing since sliced bread then ie the next it will be the 848. i often think my old pegaso for the commute was superior for around here, high millage, not one issue used in all weathers plenty fast enough (for about 60% of the time). who can say,
I'll bite... Perhaps my expectations are very low but I don't get the "cheap hand controls" comment, especially as the controls (by which I mean the switchgear) are the same as those fitted to the Monster, Panigale etc. The clutch and brake levers are no better and no worse than those fitted to my old Supersport. Ducati have used some budget items on the bike, things like the rear shock, chain adjusters and the brake pedal are definitely not top drawer items, but you can see that a mile off... In other areas, fitments like the massive Panigale-sped radial front brake, and addition of ABS is definitely highly effective and high-quality kit. The seat is uncomfortable after roughly as many miles as you can ride on a tankful of petrol and not much is delivered in the way of pillion comfort. The throttle efficacy is very subjective, and yes it's quite sensitive but it's not a problem throttle by any means. Getting away from the lights is a smooth affair and it's peppy, if you were looking at a 1200 Testastretta engine without riding modes then you might find it too much, but on an 803cc air-cooled motor it just feels keen. The first time I rode a demo I noticed it, but that was on a busy afternoon on a main arterial road in Lincoln. As I calibrated myself for the bike it became a non-issue and after fifty or so miles total on the bike I was dialled into it and now really enjoy the throttle. If you're riding a bike ordinarily in an Urban ride mode then you will likely notice the lack of "elastic band" feel and the directness of wrist-input:action is crisp on this bike. It's a characteristic though, not a fault IMO. I wouldn't be surprised if Ducati slip out a map-modification though that softens this, as the throttle action has been widely reported as an issue and if they're targeting ham-fisted new riders then they might choose to change the profile. The marketing of the Land Of Joy (ugh) was definitely a bit full-on, and yeah for sure you can buy an MT-07 for less, but in terms of it being a characterful companion and a bike that you *want* to ride, and ride often and whether you're in the mood for a gentle pootle in the sun or a brisk bit of backroad fun... it's ace! The reason I mentioned the 1200 is that on Monday my own Scrambler went into Italia for its first service and I borrowed a Monster 1200S for a few hours. I had an absolute blast on the Monster and as I was returning it I must admit to wondering how my Scrambler was going to feel after the endless power and gizmos and the sheer presence of the Monster. Although I was pleased to see my little Classic sitting cheerily in the sunshine waiting for me I had a pang of fear that it'd feel a bit weedy afterwards... nah, it was an absolute hoot to ride home and just puts a smile on my face each time I ride it. With the running-in fairy now off my shoulder I was able to ride the Scrambler as hard as I wanted on the way back and compared to the Monster my main notes were: 1) The Scrambler gets off the line with less fuss. This is a Testastretta characteristic, and the Monster needed more of a handful to get going, whereas the torque lowdown that the air-cooled motor delivers just eases away without drama. In town, or when chilled this is nice. 2) Whoever designed the rider / pillion peg relationship must have had tiny feet, as the Monster doesn't give the rider enough heel room if you're someone with average size feet who rides on their toes. 3) The handling at real-world road speeds is no better on the Öhlins-equipped Monster than the budget-suspended Scrambler, the Scrambler is more willing to be silly in the twisty bits and you need to manhandle the Monster into playing nicely with a lot more conscious input for cornering. At the sort of speeds where you need to know that your suspension has your back covered with more capability than you'll ever need, the Monster has you covered. Whereas if you're serious about it then you will find the limits of the Scrambler and at the sort of pace where wind-blast is forcing you to hang on tightly there's a definite feeling of consideration of what you're asking of the smaller bike. Reality check: the Scrambler starts to fuss and fluster in twisties at three figure speeds, but it reaches those speeds briskly and at 50-80mph it's absurdly fun. I live somewhere with very quiet and reasonably well-surfaced rural roads where 90º corners are never more than a few hundred metres away. But with a pillion at 85mph on the M18 I never felt insecure on the Scrambler... and am considering going off exploring on it, just have a look on Scramblerforum at how many happy Brits are whooping it up around Europe on these already... 4) The seat... it's the elephant in the room and the Monster showed just how poor the Scrambler seat really is. With a similar gel construction to the Monster the Scrambler seat would be a winner, but in comparison it feels like Ducati stuffed it with a thin layer of old scrunched up old newspapers. A shame as the one on the Classic in particular is a pretty looking thing. My bum preferred the Monster... and that's a gross understatement. As a point of reference there is a "Comfort Seat" available for the Scrambler and Italia now have one fitted to their Icon demo. It's a night and day difference... but is only available in black. So a) why is the OE seat not a comfort construction, and b) why is the comfort seat not available in brown? This just seems mindless as one thing EVERY Scrambler rider will do is sit on the thing, irrespective of how / where they'll ride it... to put an uncomfortable seat on a new model just is nuts as it's a totally avoidable gaffe, and a ride-all-day seat as standard would bring in more riders and their Scrambler-revenue than the cost-saving delivers in terms of profit-margin. Having to stump up for a "Comfort Seat" is an admission of defeat, and I'd argue that this is a fundamental product flaw. 5) The mirrors are much nicer on the Monster. I think that the Scrambler mirrors do the job OK but they neither look ace or work in such an outstanding way as to make themselves irreplaceable. I also am disappointed that the rubber covers are so loose at the base of the mirror head... that's poor design or manufacture. I was advised that "they all do that sir"... You can't please all of the people all of the time, but I'd ask you Phil what you were expecting from the Scrambler? You said you were disappointed in it, so what were the expectations you had of the bike that it did not meet? That'd be really interesting to know, as an owner.
You 'bit' but then kinda agreed with most of what I said ;-) I agree my switch gear comment is a little harsh, I think I mean the grips being quite plastic and some of the indicator switch that I didn't like. The seat, well... I am 6ft and I really struggled with it, felt that it's maybe too flat. The Icon Bars are much preferred by me but I still want the bars to be further forward, I found that when accelerating I am always 'hanging' off the bars, even with the power it had, It just didn't feel comfortable to ride. The one I rode had a Termi pipe and upmap, the throttle seem to surge a lot at constant throttle and I want that sort of bike to be about easy of riding and low speed work. Ultimately I guess I am saying that I much prefer the the Monster 696, I absolutely love that bike and think I can have just as much fun on it as a Scrambler. Like arseholes, everyone has an opinion though, I am not in anyway shape or form attacking anyone that has one.
Hah, yeah perhaps I did agree with it... but I think I'm a bit in love with mine and want everyone else to feel the love too... Sounds like you gave it a decent crack and didn't gel with it, fair enough and you're right about the 696 too, my Dad had a sit on a 696+ and said it felt immediately right, and that Monster I borrowed was a cracking bit of kit too. I totally get the naked thing now, and being a sportsbike wallah didn't really understand it until I tried one.
Yeah I agree, I'll be honest and say that I still got the appeal and my dad has a Thruxton which I adore, I guess I'm stuck in the middle. I wanted the buttery smooth feeling of the Thruxton engine, with the suspension from the scrambler and the look of the scrambler. I will admit that I can see sales for the Triumph scrambler falling off a cliff, the engine is only tuned to around 45hp and the weight is a killer along with crap brakes. Tbh I'm still surprised by this list, as usual it's one of those things, the scrambler could be number one based on overall opinion and sales, but how can the R1 possibly be? I've never seen one or know anyone who has ridden one to comment on how good it is, we don't know if it's reliable, if customers are having issues etc so I'm just a little confused about their measurement
+1 on the Thruxton, I like them very much and was almost seduced by a Bonneville Black, I think they look great. The Triumphs are I suppose the classic option, but you're right about the weight and power... the Kawasaki W800i was also a contender, that thing has a very handsome engine and seems to be beautifully built. As you'll gather, I was in the market for a "chilled" bike to ride comfortably when not in sport-mode at lower speeds but still having fun. A few blokes locally have R1s and seem happy enough with them, I don't think they're plagued with problems and fall into the "rides itself" category with all the rider-aids. Looking around our local bike lay-by on a Sunday and it's wall-to-wall S1000RR / RSV4 / Panigale / R1 / Fireblade / H2 stuff... it's always nice to grab a coffee and have a nosy at others' bikes and IMO the new R1 is initially quite a looker, but when you compare it to a Panigale or the jewel-like S1000RR it looks a bit like it's missing all of the fine-grain detailing you'd expect on a bike of that calibre (and cost). The Panigale or RSV4 have so many angles and details that every time I look at one I find another bit to ooh and aah over... the R1 lacks that, but I don't doubt it's an outstanding machine and I've not seen anyone get off one with a long face yet*. * except for Michael Dunlop...
I have the R1 and its is awesome BUT you sacrifice any comfort you would have hoped for in even the smallest amount that might be available ok a superbike. It is without doubt an exceptionally fast, agile eye catching crotch rocket. It is also the most uncomfortable bike I have ever had, age my be a factor but at 46 and in good shape I hope thats not the case! Power delivery is smooth and instant, gears change almost seamlessly with the excellent quickshifter. The fuel tank empties way to quickly and I found myself putting over £30 in her when out for a Sunday blast!! It goes where you point her. I have had ohlins txt put on the rear and ohlins forks and that has helped massively because on standard suspension it is rock hard plank of wood between your legs!! It looks great, people in cars yell good stuff out the window egging me on to give it some at the lights... It is a bike that will cost you your licence or far worse even though all the trick modes are there she can and will no doubt get out of shape,, no bike is un crash able !! I love it but not for long journeys and by long I mean anything over an hour. It has begged the question 'Why for the road?' The only real answer is "because I can" and/or Yamaha can! I also have the Scarmbler Urban Enduro, I picked her up on Tuesday and have only put 60 miles on her. It is the counterbalance to a bike like the R1. It has enough horses to get you briskly around town and country lanes in relative comfort, I haven't done enough miles to put the seat down but I agree it could be more 'thruxton soft' (yes I had one). The riding position feels good, no cramped legs, no acheing wrists back or neck and a good commanding view of what lies ahead. Budget bike? At 8k I disagree, fit and finish is good maybe not BMW RnineT good but good none the less. Yes the grips are 'plasticky' but I don't really see anything else that yells 'cheap'. It does what it says on the can, simple back to basic no frills biking that puts a smile on your face. Its possible that the media scrum building to the launch and the advertising blurb that has accompanied it since has left a sour taste in some 'Ducati die hard mouths' keeping them from giving it a chance. I don't like the ' land of joy' bullshit and the scrambler labelled catalogue in much the same way that I dislike anything HOG. It is not a bike that would be the ONLY bike in the garage..it's an excellent second bike that makes you smile, isn't a chore after 1 hour, it costs very little to run and insure. I wont be put out if I put her in the garage covered in gunk, I would be pissed putting the R1 away in any way other than showroom condition! The Scarmbler is for all round 2 wheel fun, the R1 and anything in the same class are one trick ponies, albeit a fantastic trick. I tried the monster 1200 stripe, BMW RnineT, s1000r and all are good bikes without a doubt. I have had a 996, 749, hypermotard sp, 1098s plus some non ducati bikes and the hyper is probably the only bike I would associate with the scrambler for the FUN factor. It's also the only bike I have regretted selling. I am looking forward to a good few miles of fun on the Scarmbler regardless of the nay Sayers and non believers. If I don't fall in love Ei her its back to the hypermotard sp! I don't care much for polls in magazines, I buy bikes with a combination of factors in mind. A. I like how they look. B. I like how they ride. C. Affordability. Sorry to have gone on and on and on ......
As a Scrambler owner I'll chuck my bit in here. I've got the Urban Enduro model, and I'll start by admitting I absolutely love it! Mine is well run in, and having done 400 miles in a day to Belgium, the UE seat seems far far better than the stock Icon. The stock grips had a couple of ridges that you could feel through your gloves, a bit like your gloves had bunched up. £10 worth of Oxford soft touring grips sorted that, so no great shakes. The switchgear is identical to that fitted to the Pani R(excluding the shift buttons obviously ), so I'm not sure what the gripe is there? A mate is borrowing mine when we ride to Paul Ricard for the Bol in a few weeks, I'll be on my Radical Pantah, and I'm jealous of him! To make up for it, I've booked ferry crossings for a 2 week tour of Morocco next April I my also try to sneak in a cheeky track day before I fit off road tyres. I also commute on it. For me it just does everything, without me worrying about every little scratch and mark it'll pick up on the way. But you know the best thing, it makes me smile every time I ride it
Be amazed if anyone really contests the scrambler, well maybe as a top 10, but the H2 batbike?! May as well have been electric...
A life long friend is in the extremely fortunate position of being able to own a widely varied collection of bikes made by various manufactures over the past 80yrs and his latest addition is an H2. I'm also extremely fortunate as he's always "plays nicely" and share his toys with me . Love or hate the look of it the H2 is a very very special bit of kit, yes it's f**kin uncomfortable, way to quite (he's going to cure that problem), the fuelling isn't the best and it's mega expensive, but. The detail & finish is astonishing, the power is like nothing else I've ever ridden and it achieves exactly what it was meant to which is make the owner/rider feel exclusive, special, in awe. The H2 is truly a fantastic bit of kit but that said even if I could afford one I wouldn't want to own one, we're all different and long may it stay that way, it's what make it all so very interesting .
I have, and I don't understand.... I'm simple see... I do have an 899 though which I am completely in love with though, so can I be forgiven this little indiscretion?
Why all this hate for Scramblers??? Shouldn't we be directing our bile where it belongs, to the Multistrada owners? Thread moved to Multistrada Forum.
Ok so little over 200 miles on the urban Comfort wise: seat could be better, not awful but surely they could have put something on it to make the rider WANT to stay on her all day long. Engine/Performance: sprightly, throttle is snatchy, hope they have a fix for it as it is a bit annoying but doable. It handles really well, easy through the bends and certainly no slouch, I am pleasantly surprised. I have a standard can which is way to quite and ridiculously big/heavy, an SC Projects lies in wait ...should raise the volume a few levels Economy: excellent the reserve tank read 20.0 as I held my breath reaching a fuel stop. Reaction: fellow bikers and joe public have so far offered approving looks/comments. Happy I bought it, few mods to do but its great fun.
