999 rust in tank 2006 !

Unfortunately, if a bike is stored without a full tank of fuel, condensation builds up above the petrol and this can happen. It should have been picked up when the fuel filter was changed, but it looks like it never has. Bad luck, you may want to try this product to sort it out POR-15 Motorcycle Fuel Tank Repair Kit | Frost Auto Restoration Techniques. Duke

 

Standing too long/not enough use? My 05 has done 24k, only used in summer and had a year off duty in 2009 and the tanks fine. Lives indoors or garage with quilt. I read somewhere to leave tank full when storing for 6 months but only did that this year and a lot evaporated so not sure about that.

 

Really...how upset would you be if you had a real problem?

 

I had a 748R with a similar problem.
Looks like yr on the case clearing it out, new filter and clear out the area under the pick-up.

I'd be pissed off with the dealer also. Not sure of the service schedule, but I suspect that due to the difficulty getting at the fuel filter it has prob never been touched.

Good luck getting it sorted.

 

How good is this stuff? I've got a 748 with a bad rust problem in the tank

 

How is this Ducati Glasgows fault?

 

I'm not suggesting this dealer was negligent in its servicing, but I know a mechanic who used to work for a Ducati dealer and he told me that they never replaced the in-tank fuel filters as part of a service as its just to much of a PITA and took too long. As its part of the service schedule they had to claim to have done it, and even had to order parts from Ducati so as to make it appear that they were using the parts, but they just chucked the new ones away as they couldn't stay in stock. He had a bag of new fuel filters he'd kept. It wasn't DG by the way.

Remember a couple of years ago when ducati reduced its service times and costs? I reckon all they did was pull out of the service schedule all the unnecessary work that wasn't actually getting done anyway.

 

To sort out the issue, I would flush the tank thoroughly to remove any remaining rust. Put some fuel in it (about 1/4 or 1/2 a litre should be enough) and give it a damn good shake to loosen off as much rust as possible. Dump the fuel and repeat. Keep doing that until rust stops coming out. I've had a 600SS tank that I had to scoop handfuls of rust out of the bottom before flushing!

Replace the inline fuel filter, clean the pump pickup and don't forget to clean out the breather lines as well.

Unless you've got major rust damage on the inside of the tank - which it doesn't look like from the pics - then you won't need to do anything else with it. The tank I had that was full of rust was fine after it was cleaned out and worked for another 5 years without any further issues or rust build up when it was looked after.

If you wanted to be really anal, you could do the above and then clean the tank inside with soapy water to flush it further. I wouldn't use any of the "tricks" such as using Coke, or filling it with ball bearings and shaking to loosen the rust, as yours really doesn't look that far gone, and you'll either end up causing more damage or just making a whole load of mess for nothing!

Those inner tank treatments are great if your tank is leaking, but for the effort involved (disassembly, blocking breathers, mixing resins, etc) it's really not worth worrying about for your tank.

Fuel is hygroscopic so it will absorb water from the atmosphere. That also includes when it's sitting in the tanks at the petrol pump. Over time the water will separate from the fuel and form a layer on top of the fuel, which is when it starts to rust the insides.

The advice on storage is to either leave your tank fully empty (and the cap open to allow it to vent) or to fill it to the brim if you plan to leave it for any length of time. Personally I wouldn't brim the tank due to the hygroscopy of the fuel and also you wouldn't want to run the fuel if it had been standing for more than a couple of months anyway. And it costs a fortune ;-)

 

I used it on two petrol tanks in my lightweight landrover. Its easy to use and did the trick for me. It basically coats the inside of the tank thus sealing the rust. If I remember correctly, Drain the tank, rinse with the metal etch provided in the kit and then pour it in and shake. I think it sets quite quickly. My tanks were weeping fuel, this stuff sorted them.

 

That's a bit of bad luck, i hope you get it sorted with minimum fuss.
It reinforces my personal standing of never letting anyone service my cars or bikes. Many would say that the lack of service record would be damaging to the value of a bike/car. But anyone worth their salt buying a Ducati or a V8 Jag should know what they are looking for or accept the service has been conducted by myself to a high standard. Ive never had anything but praise from people who know how well I look after the cars/bikes Ive had.
That said, my garage collection is not of high value or new enough for anyone to worry about the service history.

 

its brilliant
i used it on my 95 748 when it leaked petrol due to a perforation hole
its like having anew tank inside your tank..it cures to some sort of plasticy consistancy and will never rust again

 

Had the tank off my 10 year old 749 this year for a respray, no rust and I've always stored with a full tank. Filter changed as per the service schedule by Geoff at Baines Racing, strangely he did not mention it being a PITA? Perhaps find a good indie for future service?

POR stuff is pretty good and rated by the car restoration and kit car fraternity.

 

I think that the problem of water condensing in the tank over winter when the bike is unused is more dependant on how/where you store the bike than whether the tank is empty or full.
If the bike is kept in a garage or shed where there is some heating, then every time the heating is put on the warmed air will condense its moisture content on any cold surface.
This was particularly noticeable on my little lathe which, being a big heavy lump, retains its cold temp for long periods. It used to literally drip with condensation for ages if I put any heating on during winter.
I know a heater makes things more comfortable for working on your bike in winter, but nowadays I never heat my workshop, and condensation on the lathe is almost non-existent.
My 13yr old monster lives in there, with whatever fuel happens to be in the tank (usually very little over winter) and there is no sign of rust in the tank.
It wouldn't be a problem if the area is kept constantly heated, but intermittent heating is a big issue.
So if you heat your garage, my advice would be to stop, and buy a nice, warm boiler suit for winter working.
The alternative would be to keep it heated 24/7 throughout the entire cold season, which seems unnecessarily wasteful to me.
Good ventilation helps too.

 

Not one but two threads to answer!

I would have appreciated if you had spoken to me as the owner of this business, prior to posting these pictures here but since that time has come and gone, I was going to email you or call you directly but I am happy to respond here as it seems evident this forum is where you would prefer to air these views. I will copy this post and put it on the other thread(s) started on this topic so that both you and our other interested members can make up their own mind.

I must admit I am a little upset at the apparent venom behind some of your comments and your attempt to trash our name with comments such as "i'll never use Ducati Glasgow again" and "this is the first time they have been caught", at other points you claim it is not our fault yet you still persist in your attack towards us, of course rightly or wrongly, that's your prerogative but you are clearly doing your utmost to do as much damage to my business as possible and obviously I take that personally. (I've spent 11 years to get this business to this level, how would you feel?)


Also as a minor side note, I have spoken to George (our Master technician with 40 years experience) and he did not, as you suggest say it was fine to post pictures. However I do not have a recording of that conversation to prove to everyone otherwise so will draw a line under this element of the topic.


To clarify, your 999 is in fact our ex demonstrator from 2006 and does not have a full service history i'm afraid, it was sold to you as that i'm sorry but you will need to take that up with the seller. Although we have serviced it at points over the years, for half of its life we didn't even see it! That is only a partial service history.


I’ll say right away, it's also impossible for me to get dragged into a private sale between two individuals, i'll not do that for obvious reasons. From a legal perspective, you bought the bike privately 'sold as seen'. This should all have been confirmed between both parties concerned.


As a quick point, it’s very easy to both remove the tank and pump on the 749/999 range, it isn’t a PITA at all, in fact it’s one of the easiest bikes in entire range, we do them all the time!

Basically, there are a few reasons your tank could be in this condition: -
1) You're right, it might never have been opened and cleaned but knowing the way I / we do business I know that this is frankly an absolute impossibility.
2) At any point in the last year your tank could have been left with a part full fuel tank and this could have caused your problem. It doesn't take long to happen.
3) It could have been left in a wet, condensation filled garage all winter with the fuel tank open for months if the owner was trying to prevent this actually happening. Are you convinced of how it has been stored for the last winters?
4) It could have had the tank replaced during the last year or any part of its life and we wouldn't be any the wiser. Did the owner replace the tank to sell the bike on to you? Has it ever been damaged / crashed and had a replacement tank? Has one been bought on eBay from a 2002 model? You obviously won’t know this and frankly, neither do we!! You're not going to be told that if someone is trying to sell it are you??
5) You have to bear in mind that this machine although ultra low mileage is 7 years old, things like this can happen. It's not the end of the world and can be resolved.

Absolutely anything is possible yet immediately you jump to "it's the dealers fault".


Assuming it is the original tank (which is still in question): -the blame falls on the fact that both previous owners have clearly left the bike sitting for extended periods of time and this is potentially what has caused the issue. (someone else stated this exact fact on one of the threads) Cleaning the tank would not have arrested this problem, of course I agree we will have spotted the issue but it's up to the owner to do something on the back of that info. Some choose to ignore our advice in their own infinite wisdom. Also, this corrosion could have happened in this last year - how is that our fault? Although it looks bad, I would be willing to bet money it's just a little surface rust and old fuel gunge. I can see from our records it's had two batteries in the last year from total lack of use - I am told by the seller that that is exactly why he sold it to you!

Once oxidisation starts in a tank (a reasonably common issue on older metal tanked machines that are rarely used) it's a bit like a runaway train until it is stopped with petseal or some other type of treatment, which incidentally is very effective and will completely resolve this issue for you.

Your bike has covered only 4,600 miles in its 7 year life, of course the tank will have been cleaned during that time. (although we didn't see it between 2009 and 2012 so have no idea what was happening then.)

We gave it a safety check in 2012 when we sold it again but frankly we don't pull the tank apart for that. (pressures, fluid levels etc)

It next received a battery from us in June of last year as it was suffering from lack of use.

Then in January the customer asked us to do a very minor oil change service including plugs and a safety check as it had only covered 800 miles since he bought it in may, i'm sure you are well aware that this is not a full service by any stretch of the imagination. I can inform you that at the request of the customer we did not open the tank during this minor ‘oil’ service.


However controversial that may seem to you and how you clearly consider that to be ‘poor service’, I totally disagree. The truth is that on older machines, there has to be a justifiable expense on servicing in view of mileage and time covered. This is what George means when he says some things are done but others are not deemed necessary. It’s not cutting corners at the expense of the bikes’ health, it’s an attempt by us to keep our customers’ running costs as low as possible.
If the bike is worth £5k and each year, irrespective of mileage and we insist on £400-£700 of almost needless work being carried out, no one would purchase the older machines and those that own them would find it crippling!! Surely you understand there is a bit of give and take based on decades of hands on experience and common sense??


Simply put, our aftersales department will sometimes give the bikes more work than a service demands if the bike requires it but conversely the opposite also applies if a bike is not being used. That is common sense and works in our customers' favour.


Lastly it received another battery in May of this year, due again to deep discharging / lack of use prior to your purchase.

There are a multitude of reasons your tank could have rusted but the last thing you need to do is spend a fortune on another one, that’s a bit of an overreaction tbh. Clean the tank and pump out (they are both very robust), fit a new fuel filter and coat the inside of the tank with petseal (under £20), refit and forget about it as the chances are it will never cause you any further issues.


[FONT=&quot]And next time (albeit by your comments unfortunately I doubt there will be a next time), pick up the phone and talk to me. I’ve got the authority to do more than anyone in this business.[/FONT] and I could have helped!

Mart

 

Post Number 12 who did the service and poor starting and running ?

brian.

 

This is still going on?... Yawn!...