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German Cdi/ignitors ?

Discussion in 'Technical Help' started by Mark9, Jun 28, 2020.

  1. Not a direct response to your question but;

    For less money I fitted an ignitek ignition unit to my M900 engine in place of the standard ignition units. Apart from being cheaper, it allows me to re-map and play with the ignition advance curves and add a throttle position sensor. I haven't modified from the standard curve they programed in yet and that seems pretty good. Only disadvantage over the units you are looking at is it won't directly plug in to your existing sockets, so would need fitting and wiring in.
  2. Haven't used any yet but would have no hesitation trying anything from the "Duc or Die" current range.
  3. Thanks for the responses, I think I’ll go for the German units, I’m not looking for mappability just reliability as I think one unit is “on the blink”, I had a slightly wet plug, swapped the units over and that condition moved to the other plug so my best guess is it’s not giving a good spark at low revs, strangely this morning I swapped the units from my 900ss onto my monster and it ran like a dog, backfired and didn’t want to run below approx 2k revs, same part number on all units so that’s confusing!, I’ll have another look later potentially I made a poor contact at the plugs as I can’t think of any reason that the units from the 900ss wouldn’t run the M900.
  4. That’s right of course, they were both BB1105 then. That’s quite a fine tuning symptom, it could be you have early signs of pick up unit insulation breaking down and/or sleeved link to same within crankcase, all running in hot oil, it’s surprising they last as long as they do. Have you tried the coils from the SS as well?
  5. Im concentrating on the ignitors first Chris due to the wet plug issue following the Ignitor when I swapped them left to right, that’s not to say that there aren’t other contributory issue but as usual it’s make one change at a time, agree I’m sur the units are from 1991 and 1996 respectively and it is amazing how long they last, that said the ignition system on my 1955 James Captain was original (minus the points ) and that still worked! (although now improved by fitting an Electrex set up).
  6. understood, but as you've hit a "fine/sensitive tune" symptom it would be good to see what effect different coils had (or not) for me anyway. Are the coils the same or bulky grey body/black body?
  7. Yes, black body on both, I’ll certainly move onto the coil swap Chris if needs be, next step is to examine/clean the contacts in the Ignitors and plugs and the rest of the wiring in that system to figure out why I had the issue this morning with the 900ss units.
    (Although it could be as simple as I didn’t push a connector fully home in my rush to do the swap and get out before it rained, which it didn’t!)
    #8 Mark9, Jun 28, 2020
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2020
  8. Good Luck, don't forget what I said at #5 as despite what is said, pick-ups don't always fail completely or partially fail only when engine hot and sometimes just an intermittent short where the leads to the pick-ups are connected internally can be all that's wrong.
  9. Thanks Chris, I’ll update (after I’ve mustered the energy to open the garage door).
  10. i'm the same, couldn't be bothered to search for exhaust studs from workshop so ordered instead..
  11. Slightly concerning development!, just went into the garage and tried to start the 900ss, turns over, no hint of starting, Ok charged the battery, (didn’t seem low though), took the Ignitors off, cleaned the connectors on the Ignitors and in the plugs with electrical contact cleaner, put em back, tried to start , nothing, then a big backfire from the left exhaust, tried again, same, not even a hint of a start, then just a backfire from the left exhaust!, hmmm, locked the garage up and will mull things over until tomorrow!
  12. Ok, it’s not the Ignitors, I’ve tried both on the rear cylinder side of the system and get a very healthy spark at that plug and that cylinder fires when the spark plug is back in the cylinder, I’ve tried both Ignitors on the front cylinder side and got zero spark, I’ve checked the connections on the coil and everything is in place, the only thing that I disturbed when previously swapping Ignitors around was the plugs into the Ignitor, I’ve checked that the pins align correctly so contact is being made, I’m wondering if a cable to the plug has broken internally inside the insulation and hence the Ignitor for the front cylinder isn’t receiving a charge?

    The above is exactly what it was, I just pressed the starter whilst waggling the connector plugs, she’s burst into life!, so I’ll have to see if I can get a bit of slack and refit the connector a little further down the loom, I’m pretty sure the break is at the sharp bend where the loom enters the small plug , could be the other plug so I suppose I’d better do both:-/
    #13 Mark9, Jun 29, 2020
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2020
    • Like Like x 1
  13. The 2 pin connector is for the pick up. M900 manual says should read 100 ohms =/- 5%. The 3 pin plug has +12v supply and ground so easy enough to check. The other pin goes to the ignition coil.

  14. Thanks, I’ll check it out.
  15. And just in case you have mixed up the wires from the pickups.
    This is the horizontal :

    And this is the vertical:

    And if you have a scope, this is what the output waveform from each pickup should look like :
  16. Thanks Derek, I remade the plugs and all is now good, I was about to go out for a ride but of course it’s started raining:(
  17. That happens to me all the time. The rain usually comes on between me getting the bike out of the garage then coming out of the house after getting my riding gear on :(
  18. Ha, it’s needs us to get too hot getting the gear on and be looking fwd to cooling down over the first mile!
  19. So it's to cool me down. I'll remember that for future occasions when the rain come on as I'm preparing to leave.
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