Swollen Yuasa Battery

Discussion in 'Technical Help' started by rodericb, Jan 8, 2019.

  1. Hi all, I am in the process of changing the old (5 year old I think) Yuasa battery for a Earth-X, have just removed the old Yuasa and have found it slightly bulging on each cell. The bulges aren't huge - about 2mm. The bike has been sat there for something like six months, the battery is totally dead. So swollen cells is from gas being produced and the bike did often sit on a c-tek trickle charger. Would this be the cause? C-tek chargers can give up in spectacular fashion so that may be the cause, or could it be the charging system on the bike itself?

    The reason for the change is that the bike stopped dead one day, wouldn't re-start and charging it up for the next day or so didn't give it enough juice to turn the engine over....
     
  2. It’s not unknown for a battery to just fail without any other contributing factors, I had a battery on my Multistrada do just that. What you need to sort out though is if there was an initial problem like your regulator/rectifier failing. With a new battery fitted and the bike running, use a digital volt meter across the battery terminals to see what volts you are getting from the charging side. At tick over you should see about 13v and at higher revs up to about 14.5v. Not sure if you have a shunt type reg/rec or not so just a word of caution, if the reg/rec has failed you could see quite a high voltage so switch the bike off. If it’s a later type reg/rec, you’ll see less than 12v if it’s failed. Hope this makes sense and helps. Andy
     
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  3. thanks, I'll check that. Would the little volts indicator in the display show that voltage?
     
  4. That display isn't accurate enough for proper fault diagnosis on the charging system. Use a proper voltmeter.
     
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  5. Forgetting for the moment about Lithium Batteries and subsequent risk of fire withing the charging system of the bike (which has been covered on here extensively if you do a search) - will the Earth X battery fit in the application of a 749/999 due to how the battery is mounted - I understand the Earth X has centrally positioned terminals which may hinder on the installation?

    Why the change to Lithium instead of a replacement Yuasa? :thinkingface:
     
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  6. Damn those old fashioned batteries, they swell up and then fracture leaving you stranded with acidic stuff everywhere. Go for a decent Lithium, fit and forget, never need to charge it because it holds its charge, saves about 3 kgs on the weight of the bike (even if most riders cannot feel the weight saving), and has more cranking amps. :D:D:D
     
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  7. Burns much better too so good in winter :bucktooth::upyeah: especially on 999 1098 and sport classic era bikes funnily enough :bomb:
     
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  8. Still waiting for mine to burn, it never did on the 848 and still hasn't on the 939 Supersport.
     
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  9. Nice :) other than that you’re ok though? :worried:
     
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  10. Thread moved
     
  11. I have never been in an airplane when it has crashed.

    In fact, I'm pretty sure that airplanes don't crash.
     
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  12. Bob, AGM batteries as fitted to later 748s, 996s and 998s for example don't do as you suggest as the acid is held in the absorbent glass matt(hence AGM).
    I have had three reg fails on my 748 in 30k mikes and one of those failed to high voltage and damaged the AGM battery, melting a hole in it and causing it swell. For the record the regulator that failed on this occasion was an Electrex RR53 which uses Mosfet design and can be fitted to all the later 3 phase 748/996/998 bikes as well as the 848 as a direct replacement. The only indication of the failure was a slight eggy smell. 150 miles later, fault finding to see what the smell was, the battery voltage was good at 12.9v, with the engine running there was 19v across the battery! About a thimble full of acid had leaked out leaving some spatter marks on the frame paintwork behind the fairings. Otherwise the bike was 100% functional with no indication of any electrical issues bar the odd smell which by then had dissipated. A cheap lithium battery could and eventually would have caught fire on that journey home and a more expensive one with a voltage control device fitted was a diode or capacitor failure away from doing the same - I got away with it but could have continued driving the bike as many would have done oblivious to the developing problems.
    With the older bikes the regulators will fail if you do the mileage, it is simply a question of when and then how. If that failure is to high voltage as mine was you can see what is likely to happen. Just saying but unless the system is designed for it, it is a bit like Russian roulette and simply saying "well mine hasn't caught fire yet" is not really a sensible argument.
    I now pay very close attention to the charging system and battery health but would never consider a Li battery on the 748 for extended or commuting road use over long periods of time. Low mileage and track use maybe. Incidentally Electrex include this on their website https://www.dropbox.com/s/f5ekhntoafnc693/Battery Types.pdf?dl=0
    They are obviously concerned about receiving fire damage claims resulting from reg rec failures just like mine
     
    #12 Denzil the Ducati, Jan 8, 2019
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2019
  13. I'm flying soon :blush::upyeah:
     
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  14. And if it had been a Li battery it would very likely have set light to the Reg/Rec and surrounding area :bomb:worth warning people (funnily enough which is what the manufacturer does too!), up to them if they listen or just ridicule as some like to...……. :eyes:
     
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  15. Thanks Denzil, I do know what an AGM battery is.
    Now that is an interesting concept. Can you tell me the difference in the system design between a Pani 1299 with a Lithium battery as opposed to a Pani with a "normal" battery? I have never had anyone who can.
    Don't forget the most flammable part of your bike is the tank full of fuel, that is quite explosive. Makes me not worry too much about the lithium battery that has given sterling service for the past 4 years.
     
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  16. image-48029464-funny-baby-pic.jpg
     
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  17. A bulging battery is caused only by excessive heat and NOT gas pressure.
    Over voltage charging, resulting in excess current, resulting in excessive heat.... END OF....
    Brilliant advice above regarding replacing with Lead Acid battery.

    I can also confirm that after my history of hundreds of flights that planes never crash, as I've never been in a plane crash.
    Anyone who says they've seen a plane crash on telly or read about one is wrong, as I've never actually seen one....
    HAng on .... I did see one at heathrow a few years back, but that went overhead without it's engines running.... and when I finally got my fat arse to the runway it look like this.....
    [​IMG]
    This could have been staged, as it doesn't fit with my preconceptions or experience, which given that I've not had a plane crash means I've got loads.


    I saw the thread title and thought......
    SWMBO did get me a Marzipan cake this Christmas!!
     
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  18. The Earth-X battery comes with little bus bars to convert it to side-connection. The width of the battery is about 2cm less than the Yuasa and the bus bars have enough 'swivelability' to take up most of that difference. I packed out the gaps with some of the supplied foam to take up the vertical clearance and packed out the gap on the left side of the battery box with more foam that I had laying around.

    As for going with that battery and not the Yuasa, I don't ride the bike much (1,000km per year....) so it sits on the battery tender a lot of the time. These LiFe batteries are supposed to hold their charge for a long time which will save me having to sit the bike on the charger.

    Thinking about this whole charging system drama, is there something on the market along the lines of the c-tek 'comfort connector' which would show the actual volts going in to the battery? Or, where the c-tek indicator shows under, something which will also show over a given voltage? Then you could monitor the voltages.
     
  19. Aircon spends his life trying to stop people using lithium batteries. He is a bit like a Jobless Witness in his determination to rid the world of them despite many people using them and even bike manufacturers fitting them as standard.
    He has used some weird analogy about aircraft crashes to persuade people that they should not be used.
    There is a risk with everything in life, there is a very minute risk that you might have a problem with a lithium battery, but there is also a risk that that you might have a bike fire when your regulator wiring burns on an ST2 with any battery fitted. As bikers we are all people who take risks everyday that we go out to ride.
    So sad to see someone so narrow minded to put a faceplant on every post where others have a different opinion, like a jobless witness in the pursuit of persuading that everyone else is wrong!
    Still waiting for someone to tell me if the Ducati 1299 Pani that was fitted as standard with a Lithium battery has any different parts in the charging system to a Pani with a "normal" battery.
    Come on Aircon, get a life, live and let live.
     
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  20. the aircraft analogy was Liz dicking about.
    A UK manufacturer of Mofset type Reg/Recs say 'do not use Lithium'
    He has never said there is a difference between the Pani Charging System and has always said do not use Lithium unless the charging system has been modified.
    You are being very silly about all this, a bit like Dukey in the Brexit Thread :thinkingface:
    Back at ya, get a life - do not use Lithium batteries on older Ducati's is sound advice - take it or leave it, but don't troll it with miss information and false comments :):upyeah:
     
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