Who on here has gone from owning riding one of the previous generation of Superbikes to the 1199 and can you share with us how has it been. Do you miss the torque and the laziness compared to the revvy characteristics of the 1199? How's the finish compared to your previous generation bikes?
Main and most noticeable difference is the ease of use , can ride all day on track and still walk afterwards , where as my Bayliss was real hard work . Still suffers from the same wheelie issues as the 1098/1198 even though there is less torque . Pani is such a nimble bike it's an absolute joy to ride . Still a proper duke though , a quick ride on s1000rr and zx10-r emphasises just how much of duke it is .
So it's fast in and high corner speed without revving it's nuts off? What about the cosmetics as good quality as your Bayliss? Don't you miss the grunt? I found it all just a bit frantic on the 1199 and not any quicker than the RSV4 which is a modern, easy to ride, flickable as a flickable thing of a bike. In truth they are all much of a muchness and you have to be going ballistic to really appreciate the speed difference of the BMW and that's really for track days only, all of them are a good bit slower than my Desmo, but as you say much easier to ride. Which s1000rr did you ride, new or old? I think I need to go out on our first dry day and see what I should have this year. I rode the MVF4, the Priller, the 1199 and the Desmo back to back last year, think it should be the BMW HP4, zx10-r, 2013 MVF4 & the 1199, any other candidates worth trying out?
I rode the bikes at Aragon , the best was probably the ZX10-R (It had ohlins 30 mm kit up front and ttx rear) . Very easy to ride , top anti wheelie package ) it's was not my thing but still a fantastic package . The BMW was 2012 with ttx rear , gas forks and carbon fibre wheels . Didn't think it was as good as the Kawasaki , it felt like a big bike which didn't suit me . In terms of speed the Beemer was probably the quickest , it just crept away from the ducati at the end or the long straight above 150mph . ( top speed on ducati was 178 before some heavy braking .) My Bayliss was as fast but it had factory cams and a real good cam set up by G tec . I found that hard to ride as it had too much torque . Having ridden a few desmosedicis I'd say both the pani (with its full system and dialled in cams ) and the Bayliss are quite a bit quicker but I've never dragged them back to back . On the road I don't know how'd you'd tell them a part as I generally ride 2 valve aircoolers so i don't see speeds above 100 mph
Oh forgot to mention ....it's a bit quicker than the rsv4 , tried several drag races down the back straight and pani was always faster ....... Also you tend to use high rev range all the time on track so don't miss the grunt .
1098: good quality materials. Strong pull low revs but out of puff at high range. Had also full termi on and at some stage bst carbon wheels. Handling not so eager needed a bit of body help to turn bends. Factory settinhs stiff and compression damping no room to soften it up. 1199: acceptable torque low revs. crazy above 9000rpm. Handles brilliantly slightly better than 1098. Top materials and package altogether. Other bikes: owned rsv4 as mentioned similar but less power. Nice bike though and better in city riding than pani. Still habe mv agusta F4 1078 but a different bike. Faster than the pani. Also stiff. Heavier but hides it well once on the move. Had 916.996SPS compared to pani older models feel outdated more difficult to live with and of course out of power. However the feel more agressive as pani is a comfortable bike with wide handle bars and more balanced weight distribution.
Race cans on the Pani make a huge difference to felt mid range grunt. On paper makes slightly more torque than 1198, just that its at higher revs than 1198. Top end is massive, and the diiferent rider modes really affect the ride. The amount of people who have bimbled round town on race setting then tell me its no good need shooting. Got to ride it on the right road/track, in the right mode. Personally I found the 1199, S1000r and ZX10 quicker than a D16rr, but would still have a D16rr in a heartbeat.
Interesting thread chaps, not least talking to a few other people who have ridden desmos. I have an 848, a Panigale and a Desmo, so have some experience of all three - although if you search on here for my earlier threads you will see that I have struggled a bit to get the Panigale to handle as I would like. I am not alone in this, but I don't want to get into a big public forum debate again. But I am still hopeful of getting there as other people have had good experiences with theirs. Sadly for me, am just not there yet. As for the differences between them all, can't comment on the engine of the 1098R (by comparison to 848) but handling not dissimilar. They work better when you quicken the steering up quite a bit (which I have done on mine) and get a bit more weight on the front (change clip ons etc). So, between the three: 848 - now set up well and with Termi system - very easy to ride, the most forgiving geometry/stability by a long way. On track really nice, very solid in fast turns - can ride it at full throttle a lot and is very satisfying but requires body english to make it turn in quickly so suits sweeping corners etc (typical duke). Panigale - handling is housefly quick by comparison (but mine is consequently very unstable) and the engine is a phenominal bit of kit for a twin, really spins up quickly like a race engine but has good mid-range too. Top end is fantastic - but I also have full corsa system on mine and the usual JHP setup/fueling - so no idea on the stock version, I never rode one - went straight to full system version. But I am struggling to otherwise get it to work for me without being shaky and unstable. Work in progress. Desmo - again, mine is JHP treated, so GP7 system and JHP mapping - pulls 200bhp - drops everything on track! Wheelspins in a straight line in third gear! For example, coming out of Almeria final corner onto the straight, alongside a mate on a 1098R, by halfway down that straight he was miles behind, and I hardly even dare to get the desmo onto the stop it's so quick (but then as we hit the 200m marker he went flying past me anyway as I am chicken and he is good on track!)... but the desmo took a while to get setup and is sensitive to micro changes. However, I thought it was amazing before I put it on track on slicks - but since doing that, on Dunlop K106/8 race slicks (in a 195/65 profile) - wow - the thing is just sensational. That's clearly what it was designed to do. 70-170mph it is so quick and so stable, yet provides braille-level tarmac feedback. At least as quick as the panigale steering wise, yet composed, far stiffer, far more accurate and just a missile to ride. Best bike ever (in my opinion!). I love mine. I haven't ridden an IL4 in such a long time I can't honestly remember how they compare. I should go and have a go. Likewise the legendary RSV4 - but I never seem to find the time. Roy - PM me if you fancy catching up sometime. I didn't think you were a fan of the Pani by the way after your test ride?
It depends what you want. The 1098S/1198S are slower into a turn than the Panigale and their engines spin up slower but make more torque at lower revs. The Panigale spins up amazingly quickly and steers very quickly. Unlike others who've commented the Panigale is unstable at high speed, I have had no problems at all. Don't let anyone tell you it lacks power, it's true it makes it's torque at higher revs but I can't stress enough how quickly the revs rise. How the hell the Ducati engineers managed to produce an engine with such large pistons to spin so fast is beyond me. The Panigale is noticeably newer technology. However, the 1098S/1198S have their charm and are devilishly quick. I'm lucky, having an 1198S/1199S and a 1098R Bayliss. Asking me which I prefer is like trying to name your favourite child, it's impossible to do because they all have their strengths and weaknesses. If I could only keep one it would be my 1098R Bayliss because it's an animal. For ease of use and riding enjoyment it would be the Panigale. In any case, it doesn't matter what people say on this forum or what bike journalists or bike dealers say. Get out and ride them (on dry roads so you can give them some beans) and see which one is best for you.
Last Jan/Feb I tried out the bikes below as well as the s1000rr and the 1199S, I didn't take pics of the 1199 and BMW. It was good trying them pretty much back to back, I settled on a new RSV4, I liked the BMW, but didn't really want an IL4, I wanted to compare it against the MV which it was like the finished article against a prototype. I didn't get on with the Panigale, but I was expecting a traditional Ducati riding experience and that's not what you get from the Pani, that's not to say it's bad, it's just not in the lineage of the previous Ducati Superbikes. I keep wondering if I could grow to like it? The RSV4 felt like being at home, as soon as I was on it I was quick, 998GSB 'borrowed' it when evading the French in the summer and felt exactly the same. Maybe I should just go out and get a Bayliss Rep?
Mm I have to disagree on the pani. Yes the rsv4 is great bike I had the r version for a year and its a fine bike. But the 1199 is superb. And a typical ducati in ferms of engine feeling and track behaviour. Is more xomfy than my 916 more.civilised lighter etc etc i think you should give the pani a closer look. It will grow on you for sure. Inline 4s I agree but mv is a much different experience pretty much as the ducatis in terms of passion and character.
I couldn't agree more. I had an RSV4 Factory (along with my Bayliss 1098R) and although it's a great bike, everytime I rode it I couldn't help wishing I was on my Ducati. The best way I can describe it is that t was a cross between a Japanese IL4 and a Ducati. It had the noise of an Italian bike but made it's power a little more up the rev range. It handed nicely, very neutral but quick steering, nice smooth engine and superb fit and finish. It just lacked a bit of a kick. Ducati sportsbikes are like a Peperami - they a bit of an animal. Although the Panigale at first seems a bit sanitised compared to the 1198S/R, it's not. Wind it up and off it goes, almost like a two stroke when the revs start to climb. It might not have a trellis frame or dry clutch, but it handles and performs like a Ducati and I'm at a bit of a loss why some folks don't see it that way. I love it, it looks and sounds amazing, handles like a dream, turns quickly and is as fast as hell.
i' ll be doing Aragon and Valencia on the 999R mid march and the 1199R should arrive in that period.. next track days will be on the pani... so by july i'll tell you exactly i think the remapping of the midrange on the R and larger sprocket will transform the bike over 2012 ...
I am hopefully going to go up and give my Pani a spin again soon after it has had more work on it to see where we are. I remain hopeful I can get mine to work as I want - it has great potential as a bike. I love the engine character and the lightness of the bike - just need to get mine handling OK. Have gone hi and low so far, soft and stiff springs, revalved, long and short w/b too and so far it remains a handful and it remains very unstable. Mine is the S model with the light wheels et al and I am only 66kgs, but still can't quite account for why it is so sketchy (especially compared to Desmo). If I can just get it to calm down it will be a missile! I agree that the Ducatis have real "character" and are a bit of an animal - but to me that's half the appeal! If I just wanted something entirely utilitarian and functional I would get a fireblade, put a nemesis kit on it or try the S1000RR. But where's the fun in that eh?!
FWIW : from what i hear, the springs need lightening ( where one usually goes stiffer... ) .. tires : pressure ok?
I agree the 1199 turns like a housefly, in fact it feels simular to my cbr600rr, but I wouldnt call it unstable. I had to back off the rear shock a bit and it could do with a bit more fettling, but I weigh over 100 kgs and suppose that probably helps.
You should see if you can get Darren Fry's settings, he's probably in the 60kg bracket and seemed to get that working really well. Or have a chat with the motorapido guys, Scott Smart must be even lighter. Even if the running gear is slightly different, heirexperience must give them an insight
