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Advice On Smart Heating Heating Controls?

Discussion in 'Lounge' started by Ben Mallinson, Sep 13, 2018.

  1. Thats good...still...ive not had to drill into any walls etc etc...mines does come with a controller, but, its free standing..never use it though...just use the app..
     
  2. It's supposed to be, but some of our eastern European "electricians" wire mains the same way as this USB, so what do I know....:)
     
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  3. [​IMG]
     
  4. Typical contractors installation of a mine. Installed in the wrong place with inadequate supports, poor record documentation and with the wrong controls.
     
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  5. We've a Nest thermostat with Nest smoke alarms, all tied together so it works with our lights/voice control/home media hub etc... It's based on our phone locations so it only heats when the wife and I are home (or nearing it). Our boiler has an outside temperature sensor so it adjusts accordingly too.

    My boiler man tried to convince me to go with the boiler's own smart system but the only benefit that gave was that we could see boiler errors on the thermostat display. The downsides were huge though.

    With the likes of Nest, you have so many third party integrations, whereas the boiler owned systems want you to work with their infastructure only.

    I have disabled all motion sensing and gone completely with geolocation as the heating would switch off if SWMBO was at home all day and sat on her arse watchin Judge Judy and not moving. Motion sensing is now only used for alarm purposes should we both be out of the house.

    I also opted to ignore zoned systems and instead just adjusted our thermostats so the whole house heats evenly. I like the fact that, should I wish, I have many third party thermostatic valves available to choose from and am not tied in.

    Edit: Just to add - Since fitting the Nest, we've noticed a big difference. the Nest suits our lifestyle, in the our hours are varied and completely unpredictable. No amount of "smart" timer will do. We've disabled the aut learning on Nest and it's entirely based on location. No more heating an empty house.
     
    #45 JH_1986, Sep 14, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2018
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  6. We are in a similar old house predicament where my mum is home all day living in one room that she likes warm - at the moment she has one of those infra red electric heaters on one bar all day which I ‘hope’ costs less than having the gas on

    Looked at the Honeywell system with the programmable room valves by just too expensive
     

  7. Char this is a guide to what the electrickery heaters cost to run by day/ week.
    http://www.sust-it.net/heating-energy-calculator.php

    Compare that to what your gas heating costs per month are and see it its more or less per day?
     
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  8. Electric is the most expensive way to heat a house, but typically 100% efficient.:no_mouth:
    Mains Gas is at least three times cheaper, most new boilers are 90% or more efficient at turning your hard earned cash into useable heat .... if very old it may be only 50%.:skull:

    Don't forget ASHP or air conditioning in reverse is typically 350-400% efficient at heating (compared to direct electric), but this drops at very low temperatures (-10°C) to half that.:innocent:

    All of the above has to be offset against install cost and lifespan of the system fitted.:thinkingface:

    Good Insulation is key in all, as it reduces the actual amount of energy required to keep it at the right temperature for your family.:neutral:
     
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  9. Thought it was about time I updated this thread for those interested in our final decision on smart controls and the experience so far...

    In the end we decided to go down the Vaillant ambiSense route. Taking in to account our requirements and objectives, the Vaillant system enabled us to split the house in to multiple zones and also install weather compensation. An added benefit being that the boiler is Vaillant so installation and integration was seamless and trouble free.

    The post boiler installation works and commissioning was complete last time I was away at work. The controls fitted in order to meet the regs were intentionally basic as we knew we were going to remove & upgrade them ourselves shortly afterwards and the could also be sold on afterwards :upyeah:

    Mrs M mentioned a couple of times in the first couple of weeks that certain rooms were getting too warm at night and the main living space seemed to fluctuate quite a bit.

    Having ordered all the kit whilst away at work, it was sat awaiting my return last week. Installation and setup was an absolute doddle too! The VRC700 weather compensator system was literally installed within 30 minutes and setup after a further 15 minutes... The ambiSense kit was also very simple to install but took a little longer due to us having 8 TRV's to fit and setup. Once the internet gateway was installed and connected to both the boiler and WiFi, the rest was plain sailing...

    So we now have:
    - New Valillant ecoTec store 938 boiler (relocated to middle floor storage cupboard)
    - Vaillant VRC700 weather compensation
    - 6 Independently controlled heating zones (via 8 ambiSense TRV's)

    Following installation and setting the system up there was a notable difference in the radiator temps and comfort levels in each of the 'heating zones... The supply and return temps to the heating circuit have dropped considerably and it seems the boiler is happily running in its most efficient 'condensing' mode. We have the heating curve set to adaptive and it would seem the system is learning with each passing day. The time the system fires up to achieve the desired temperature by the programmed times seems to have gradually reduced which would suggest the system is still learning and adapting to the characteristics of the house, another positive sign the system is working well though.

    The reviews for the App were a little concerning to say the least when we first looked through them. So far though, everything has worked perfectly for us, changes to the indevidual zones are instantly cascaded to the system, the TRV's can also be locked out via the App which means the kids can't meddle with them and all zones have been both stable and comfortable since we started using this system.

    All in all, we're very happy with the decision we took following taking on board the thoughts and advice on this thread and after the initial experience & observations of the system, we're also hopeful that we'll benefit from reduced energy bills going forward too :)

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    Lastly and most importantly for me... Mrs M and the ankle biters haven't moaned once about any room not being warm enough, being too warm, the showers not delivering enough warm water, baths taking too long to run or the radiators not being hot enough (anything below ouch ya b*a state hot was aparrenltly unacceptable previously)

    So, all in all - I am absolutely delighted with it and looking forward to a pieceful winter :)

    P.S Before anyone pulls me up on the wiring :joy:... There are still the finishing touches to do in the boiler cupboard once I have sourced the appropriate sized cable clips :bucktooth:
     
    #49 Ben Mallinson, Oct 21, 2018
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2018
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  10. You could do with a bit of this.....
    [​IMG]
     
  11. That's one more thing I was considering strangely enough :thinkingface:

    Is it worth insulating them even though they are in a cosy cupboard in virtually the centre of the house?
     
  12. Nice system. I like that. :) :upyeah:
     
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  13. Wasn't quite expecting to shell out so much on the heating system just a few years after moving in...

    If a job is worth doing, it's worth doing right though ;)
     
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  14. I have a Salus IT500. .. Its clever rather than smart in that it's not Alexa active but does have its own app that you control it with. I live on my own so it's a treat to come home with the house warm and not need to worry if I've left the heating on needlessly.....

    Not too expensive and a four wire fix that anyone can install
     
  15. I'd insulate the hot water pipes as a minium.... You've hot water all the time, say +55°C.... so you are going to have losses all year, 24 hours a day.
    Why heat a cupboard? Grow lamps, CO2 generators... activated carbon extraction.... a drying room?
     
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  16. As said, I was contemplating insulating them just wasn't sure it would be worth it... In the grand scheme of things though, the additional cost for piece of mind is a no brainer... Confirmed by your response ;)

    Thanks for your input once again @AirCon :upyeah:
     
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  17. I do hope you guys checked for secret recording devices,...as Nest is forced to apologize. IoT_device are so cool they illegally listen too you!!
     
  18. :eyes:
     
  19. Most boring thread ever!
     
  20. Hi @Ben Mallinson
    Interested in your thread here, ‘cos i’m Looking at Honeywell Evohome which seems very similar to your Vaillant system. You discounted it as being too pricey- is there a great difference between the two in cost terms? My setup (controller plus hot water kit plus 15 TRVs) is coming in around £1200 for parts.
     
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