Google makes Pixel phones and Chromebooks (laptops). Google also allows and promotes other manufacturers to use their operating systems. Apple does not currently allow any other manufacturers to use their operating system.
Of (slight) relevance is that when Microsoft came up with Windows and before that DOS, Microsoft never made anything hardware-wise. Software is software and hardware is hardware. They are different and Apple doing hardware AND software, doesn't make them better by default. And Google do computers with their own operating system now, anyway!
The way I see it is that you are collecting data for Google. You get a cheaper handset and go out and collect data for the benefit of Google. Using Android you risk becoming a walking consumer of targeted ads that result from harvesting your data. Apple want my money, fine, fair deal. They pride themselves on end to end encryption. They have been threatened by the CIA, MI6 to allow access to user data. The British government threatened them to provide a back door to user date and they told them - politely - to stick it.
For better or worse, the UK government told Apple to open the encryption and after grumbling Apple complied. https://support.apple.com/en-gb/122234
Been an Apple user since 1991, they always work, everything links together and no issues with viruses. I also used to have to use windows products, utter crap in comparison. Not really used android but I’m sure it’s fine. I’ll stick with my Apple products though, too old to change now!
Thanks. I was totally unaware of a later more recent change in the situation. That said looking at the dates on the AI report you attached being August '25 & the Apple site I liked being September '25, they are in conflict...
I read it they’re saying the same thing, no ADP in the UK (unless you already use it), however the ‘standard’ encryption remains in place.
The point I am trying to make is that Apple appears to be on the side of the customer, going to court against Governments, so that we have data security. They have built a system with no backdoor access by anyone - even Apple themselves. All this was secret - secret government orders to comply - behind doors trying to get universal open door access. Good on Apple for standing up to this.
I'm certainly no expert Paul. The Apple info says that standard encryption will remain on Apple services in UK. It confirms UK Apple customers that ADP will not be available and we will be advised soon on how to "to disable the feature themselves to keep using their iCloud account". I understand this means the UK government will likely therefore be able to access Apple products with the exception of the icloud which will follow? Surely if Apple standard encryption was not accessible by others such as the UK government, ADP would not have been necessary? The Apple information made no reference to the UK government withdrawing its demand to be able to access Apple devices/ information in the UK. I never believe AI when it makes statements claiming to be facts without solid secondary sources. AI simply repeats the most commonly found information and regurgitates it. Its not at all scientific evidence based information. The BBC article linked below seems to imply that a court case will be heard in 2026. There is also a comment from the US administration which is ambiguous and in anycase, statements by the US Presidential appointees rarely mean anything at all. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cdj2m3rrk74o
It certainly shows that Apple are willing to take on a fight that advances their aims/ beliefs. I like the idea that Apple want to prevent the UK government snooping on us in the context of the Police, whistleblowers, other competing narratives etc. I'm not as sure its such a good idea to give people like Manchester Arena and London bombers, together with organised crime and assassins like the Russian Skripal murderers or Chinese -even Saudi/Israeli operatives unbreakable communication. Tricky question really.
The point still remains. The UK wants to impose UK law (court ruling) on Apple, on a global scale - over which it does not have jurisdiction. Agreed the AI report is a summary and there is further detail upon investigation. I believe it replied to the prompt it was given. Further prompts reveal further information. There is quite a lot going on with this story and it is still ongoing. If, as you say, safeguarding the public is the concern - then why are convicted criminals of the worst kind routinely released from prison ?
Prisons are totally full and beds must be found for the criminals most likely to harm the UK public. Between 2010 and 2024 the total number of prisoners able to be incarcerated increased by 500 beds. During the same period the UK pupulation increased by 7 million. https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/the-number-of-prison-places-built-and-closed-2010-2024 W*anker government unable to run a bath for 14 years. New construction to remedy this problem is in hand. https://consult.justice.gov.uk/digi...documents/wethersfieldprisonsconsultation.pdf LAB aims to have additional 18,000 capacity by 2031.
The UK government want access to messages, cloud and calls in the UK. Apple said that they would not grant access to ADP as this would allow worldwide access. Currently ADP is used outside the UK, and is not available to UK devices. It appears that the UK government have achieved their Just or unjust aims subject to a court decision in 2026?
The UK has not succeeded that is why the court cases are ongoing. They actually wanted a "back door" access, that is a built in weakness to be built in to encryption. Apple have argued that any such built in weakness - or "back door" access - could be exploited by hackers. Government ineptitude would guarantee that any such back door weakness code - to the Apple encryption - would probably become widely known. Then what, when everyone's global data is being ransacked by hackers and ransomware crimes committed globally - will the UK then apologise and pay global damages - because they insisted that Apple introduce a back door to the encrypted data - that was then kicked wide open by hackers ? It is inevitable that if a back door is introduced - and there is something valuable the other side of it - the door will be kicked open and it will be the fault of the UK for insisting that it be there. By that time it will be too late.
I don't know the inner workings of the UK government; whether they are right or wrong, well meant or malicious. I can see and sympathise with both sides. The UK government currently have access to Apple devices. The court case will decide upon: The UK says it needs to be able to access individuals' private data - when backed by an appropriate warrant - if there is a threat to national security. Which will prevent Apple offering UK users products of theirs which cannot be accessed by government. Apple maintains that privacy is at the heart of its business and says it will not compromise on data protection anywhere in the world. Apple will be granted or refused access to the UK market for products which cannot be accessed by the UK government. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c740r0m4mzjo AFAIK the only thing decided to date is that the trial in London must be done in public and not held in secret as originally requested by the UK government.
You do all realise the previously thought impossible has now occurred ? A Perry thread that’s interesting to read
Will there be a Trial by Jury ? Sorry I forgot Trial by Jury is to be discontinued by order of the Secretary of State for Justice. Will the BBC report honestly on the story and its outcome, or will they coble together some clips and footage and arrange them in a different order to tell a doctored version of events ?
Not sure if there will be a jury under the proposed new rules, but that idea is not law yet regardless. I can't speak to the the BBC's likelihood to make a plain unadorned & unedited statement. But given Apple's incredible marketing machine and media access, I expect the BBC will be chastened into extreme accuracy. Hopefully a new regime will be in place at the BBC soon, and the miscreants who have behaved poorly will all have left the building. The recent fiasco is a great excuse for LAB to clear them all out!
