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959 Goodies Inbound!!! Winter Weight Reduction Starts Here..

Discussion in 'Panigale' started by Dave dunlop, Oct 18, 2018.

  1. nice though!
     
  2. That makes me feel a whole load better knowing that's my wheels, Carbon Subframe and almost my K Tech shock for not that much more! With a good discount.... Yikes
     
  3. I thought it was. Still pricey, and I don’t think there is any info on weight? One of the easier jobs to do yourself.
     
  4. I know this is an old thread but I’m invested, don’t cancel the series without an ending! :broken_heart:

    How much did it weigh in the end?
    How did the changes affect the weight distribution?
    With all of the weight loss from the bike (and rider) did it need the springs changing?
    How did it handle on track?

    Don’t leave me hanging Dave - great build - hope you have enjoyed the summer on it!
     
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  5. 178kg with half a tank of fuel! What really concerned me was the weight bias. Obviously with the carbon rear end and mostly Ti bolts throughout. Sat under the front wheel was bang on 100 and rear was 78.... but here’s the thing, with me fully kitted out (dainese trickster kangaroo suit, agv pista r and pro race boots and gloves sat on the bike in a semi prone position she is is bang on 50/50! result I’ve also gone through some further weight reduction myself and down to a healthy 66kg at 5 9” .... I’ve always worked on power to weight on all my bikes as I think it’s one of the most important upgrades, along with suspension and tyres. Also setting the bike up ergonomically makes a massive difference.

    I opted for the softer 80nm spring in the rear and played around with the ride height. Set up the static and rider sags front and rear and then it was just a case of compression damping and rebound to dial in. I also dropped the forks through the yokes by 4mm just to quicken up the general feel when transitioning. Along with the weight loss I can honestly say the bike has been transformed. From a handling prospective it’s faultless. Holds an amazing line without any compromises, so little effort to put it exactly where you want it and so stable. Corner entry and exit allows you to carry far more controlled speed without it feeling a like it’s freighting you. But the biggest difference is transitioning, it’s so quick but yet so stable.

    Performance has also improved dramatically, purely due to not having to haul so much weight about, brakes also feel more effective under all conditions. I’m really happy with the way it turned out. I know it was a lot of money to sink into a bike but the transformation is nothing short of spectacular....
     
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  6. 20190606_195229.jpg
     
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  7. Side stands a bit short!
    :D:D:D:D
     
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  8. Nice job. Great thread. Enjoy!
     
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  9. Sorry Dave - I wrote a reply to this but it seems I must have done what I constantly do with work emails - get distracted and forget to press send! :confused:

    Brilliant build - a proper work of art - it doesn’t matter what it cost if it makes you happy!

    I’m with you on the power to weight Colin Chapman had it right!

    “Adding power makes you faster on the straights. Subtracting weight makes you faster everywhere”

    I’m prepping my 959 for track ready for next year - my weight reduction programme will be more about removing items than exotic carbon as the costs are already spiralling out of control and I’m already considering the consequences of binning it!

    Did you cut and apply all of the vinyl by hand? I think if I tried it it would look like something from playgroup!

    I’m surprised given the weight reduction and your own light weight that you have managed to get the rider sag settings dialled in with an 80nm spring. I’m pretty sure the stock 959 spring is 80 so I would have thought for such a light bike and rider you would have needed a lower rate?

    I have the same rear shock - picked it up on here - currently has a 75nm spring in it but I have calculated that I need an 85nm based on my geared up weight and planned weight reduction of bike.

    I found this on a US forum and it seems to tally with other resources.

    "Rider Weight (In Gear) - Spring Rate

    150 Lbs. - 75Nm
    170 Lbs. - 80Nm
    190 Lbs. - 85Nm
    210 Lbs. - 90Nm
    230 Lbs. - 95Nm
    250 Lbs. - 100Nm

    Please note these recommendations are for the suspension in the FLAT RATE setting on the 1199/1299, or on an 899/959 with the adjustable linkage kit installed. For an 899/959 without the adjustable linkage OR an 1199/1299 with the suspension set in the PROGRESSIVE setting, chose one spring rate softer than normal recommendation.

    If your weight is between the ranges, you can choose either srping rate, choose the softer rate for less aggressive riding or the stiffer rate for more aggressive riding. If you're just not sure, contact us for a recommendation."


    Based on the above - using the original linkage that would put you in the 70nm range given the weight reduction on the bike as well.

    I think I need to have a play around with the sag measurements on mine, as maybe that info is off if you are happy with the heavier spring.

    Ps - I’m jealous - I’ll never have your power to weight ratio even if the whole bike was made from Mithril and spiders webs.
     
    #69 LiveFast......, Nov 29, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2020
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  10. The stock spring is 80 but a progressive spring designed for passengers or luggage in mind, an aftermarket 80 spring will perform differently.
     
  11. As far as I know it’s the linkage that’s progressive, not the spring and it’s based on leverage principles. I understand that the the progressive setup allows for softer feel at the beginning of the stroke but then firms up as the spring compresses. This is preferred for road use with bumpy roads and pillion etc as you say, but not ideal for dialling in a track setup.

    There’s lots of conflicting info online but I found a site that lists the stock 959 setup as 70-78N (10 and 40mm) I believe this means at 10mm compression the equivalent rate is 70N and at 40mm compression it’s 78N. As the Ktech stock spring for the 959 is listed as 80N, but Dave is using the stock progressive linkage, I guess this would equate to 72-80N - and explain how it’s working ok for such a light rider and bike.

    I have swapped the stock linkage for the adjustable one from the 1199/1299 and set it to Flat rate mode as my usage will be single rider track only and therefore I would prefer a more linear and predictable shock action throughout the entire stroke.

    The 1199/1299 comes with an 86N spring due to the longer swingarm and the greater leverage it gives, but the Ktech stock spring is 90N for the larger capacity bikes so slightly firmer.

    I’m going to see how the 85N spring goes on the 959 as it seems to match my riding weight when used with the flat linkage. I would be interested to hear what others use - I’m around 92kg in full gear but I have taken into account the sprung weight loss from the bike due to track conversion and dropped a spring rate accordingly.
     
  12. Apologies if off topic....Glad I just read this, I have some Ti bolt kits coming, what do you recommend out of curiosity?
     
  13. Forgive me for being a tart, but...

    Can I ask about your stubby rear brake reservoir? I always ran these sorts of set ups on my Hondas (HRC do a special kit) and like their simplicity.

    Cheers,

    Jm
     
  14. I’ve a mix of mostly Race Ti and Pro Bolt, The only items I couldn’t source here were the main suspension bolts that came from the states. Definitely worth shopping around...
    It’s just a simple brake reservoir hose off eBay, Just cut to required length. Pick your colour and away you go..... It’s really no different to the HRC kitted version but for around quarter of the price.
     
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  15. Sorry to be a pain, but would you have a link to the kit you used?

    The HRC stuff is a different diameter to the brembo. What do you do about a stopper at the open end (the HRC kit comes with the stopper and a clip)?

    Lastly, obviously, I presume it all work ok?

    Cheers,

    Jm
     
  16. What anti seize compound did you use? Molycoat or Copaslip? Something like that?
     
  17. https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https://www.ebay.co.uk/ulk/itm/352663895577

    Yes either will work:upyeah:
     
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  18. I've been using Permatex Anti-Seize for a few years now with good results on multiple bikes with Ti in aluminium and am forever pulling them apart.

    IMG_8155.jpg
     
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  19. able, do you use the anti seize on screws that come pre loctite coated? For example: titanium front brake disc screws that go into alloy inserts. Also presume the torque values will not change either?
    Ta.
     
  20. On bolts that need to be secured with loctite there is a formula that is good for titanium I'll have a look when I get home. A fitter told me once torque values change when you lube a bolt I paint mark all my important bolts and keep an eye on them.
     
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