Hopefully the Harley Davidson group aren't so easily distracted and manage to turn the company around.
711jro said: ↑ So you are happy with that but go insane over the two domestic terrorists Pretty and Good I do genuinely apologize I thought you were one of the guys that had my post remover regarding Pretty and Good, I am sorry for that.
3? generalisations, really. Perhaps you should investigate why the crusades were initiated rather than on the fact that they were. I stand by my understanding and reading of the subject. I stand by the claim that Islam commands believers to kill non believers where they find them. Or do you regard that as a generalisation as well?
Care to offer where you have found such a statement in the Qur'an, I haven't found any mention of killing people based on their religion.
For starters..... 9:123 Oh ye who believe! Murder those of the disbelievers and let them find harshness in you 8:12 I will instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers: smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off. 3:85 Whoso desires another religion than Islam, it shall not be accepted of him; in the next world he shall be among the losers. 9:5 Slay the idolaters wherever you find them 9:29 Fight those who do not believe in God and the last day… and fight People of the Book, who do not accept the religion of truth (Islam) until they pay tribute by hand, being inferior” 47:4 When you meet the unbelievers, strike off their heads; then when you have made wide slaughter among them, carefully tie up the remaining captives. 8:65 O Prophet! rouse the Believers to the fight. If there are twenty amongst you, patient and persevering, they will vanquish two hundred: if a hundred, they will vanquish a thousand of the Unbelievers 8:60 Against them make ready your strength to the utmost of your power, including steeds of war, to strike terror into (the hearts of) the enemies, of Allah and your enemies 60:4 Hatred and Enmity shall reign between us until you believe in Allah alone Quran (8:39) – “And fight with them until there is no more fitna (disorder, unbelief) and religion is all for Allah” Quran (8:67) “It is not for a Prophet that he should have prisoners of war until he had made a great slaughter in the land…“ 9:123 Oh ye who believe! Murder those of the disbelievers and let them find harshness in you 8:12 I will instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers: smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off. 3:85 Whoso desires another religion than Islam, it shall not be accepted of him; in the next world he shall be among the losers. 9:5 Slay the idolaters wherever you find them 9:29 Fight those who do not believe in God and the last day… and fight People of the Book, who do not accept the religion of truth (Islam) until they pay tribute by hand, being inferior” 47:4 When you meet the unbelievers, strike off their heads; then when you have made wide slaughter among them, carefully tie up the remaining captives. 8:65 O Prophet! rouse the Believers to the fight. If there are twenty amongst you, patient and persevering, they will vanquish two hundred: if a hundred, they will vanquish a thousand of the Unbelievers 8:60 Against them make ready your strength to the utmost of your power, including steeds of war, to strike terror into (the hearts of) the enemies, of Allah and your enemies 60:4 Hatred and Enmity shall reign between us until you believe in Allah alone Quran (8:39) – “And fight with them until there is no more fitna (disorder, unbelief) and religion is all for Allah” Quran (8:67) “It is not for a Prophet that he should have prisoners of war until he had made a great slaughter in the land…“
Its been a while since I read into the Crusades in depth. It's also impossible to put all factors in a post. However in broad strokes this is my understanding. Each Crusade had its own causes but for the First Crusade (1096-1099) there were a few major factors: 1. In feudal Western Europe it was a response to Muslim expansion (both recently in Anatolia, Sicily, and Spain but also longer-term in the Middle East) 2. It was seen by the Papacy as an opportunity for to increase its political influence 3. It was seen by the church at large as a way to refocus devout but warlike Europeans from killing each other and kill 'more people the church disliked. 4. It was seen by the Eastern Roman Empire (the Byzantines) as a method for reconquering lost provinces and especially Jerusalem 5. It was seen by Western Crusaders as a way to absolve themselves of their sins for a worthy cause because the Pope promised them rewards in heaven. 6. It was seen by some influential crusaders as a way to gain wealth and power. These six factors probably cover the main reasons for why it began and why so many went. From the 630s Muslim armies had been expanding reaching as far as Spain in the West, and were raiding Sicily in the central Mediterranean. The Ottomans defeated the Byzantines and overran their provinces in Anatolia (modern-day Turkey) following the 1071 Battle of Manzikert. The Muslim advance was not exactly fresh news, the Holy Land had been under Islamic control for over 400 years. Though it was still seen by many Christians as a shameful thing and the Seljuk Turk advances in the 1070s and 1080s had disrupted their pilgrimage routes. The Papacy was attempting to assert its authority over the church both against political power of Kings and local church power. They had formally split with the eastern church in the schism of 1054, and were keen to re-establish both relations and Roman primacy. They constantly battled with European rulers over who should be in charge. At a local level the Catholic church wanted to appoint all Bishops, though Kings frequently chose them instead -obviously whoever chose the priests had the most influence over the common people. This is known as the investiture controversy. Then when the Byzantine emperor Alexius I Komnenos (1081–1118) sent some representatives to the Pope in 1095 asking for some Latin mercenaries to help in his reconquest wars against the Turks, the Pope (Urban II at this time) seemed to see this as an opportunity to further his aims of both repairing relations with the eastern orthodox church and increasing the influence of the Papacy in the West. The calling of the crusade was hoped to achieve this. Christians had been fighting each other for hundreds of years. The church wanted to stop the localised fighting and instead use the violence against their foes . When the Pope preached the crusade he essentially phrased it that they could be absolved of sin by dying on crusade. The crusade was marketed as a military pilgrimage. Read Jonathan Riley-Smith’s book, which explains the vast majority of ordinary people who went on the crusade sold all their possessions to monasteries but had no intention of staying in Jerusalem. However, for others the Crusades were akin to a colonial power grab, and clearly were out for self-gain. The main contenders would be Bohemond of the Norman contingent. Normans have a track record of invading places, William the Conqueror had taken the Kingdom of England only 30 years earlier and other Normans had turned against the Byzantines in Southern Italy and carved out their own kingdom there. After the siege of Antioch, Bohemond stayed on as ruler and started to carve out his own kingdom in the area. It would seem that he never had much intention of going to Jerusalem. So basically it seems that a lot of things just came to a head: church power verses secular power, Western church verses Eastern church, Muslims states verses Christian states, and religious guilt and devotion were all funnelled into the First Crusade when the Byzantines gave the papacy an opportunity to tap into. I don’t think anyone anticipated how it would pan out. It did work out fairly well for Bohemond! The later crusades had their own causes but again, for the motivations of Western participants the Holy City was often the goal.
I expect there's some Christian minded people in my family, but I couldn't really say for sure. I know there's a gay one, and some horse enthusiasts. With summer coming around I only really focus closely on the number of vegetarians as its a real issue with BBQ's...
They also make no attempt to sugar coat or excuse the atrocities when you visit the camps, which is something I believe everyone should do once.
