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The Engine Run In Myth

Discussion in 'Technical Help' started by Bondy7070, Feb 2, 2020.

  1. If Suzuki follow the same Ducati practice of using a specifically thin oil just for the first 600 miles, absolutely yes. Andy
     
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  2. Yes I've already got the oil and filter but was just wondering whether to finish off the running in on track with the original oil or change to new before track use.
     
  3. I will check that out Andy.
     
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  4. Interestingly, BMW in their M-Cars use very very soft main shell bearings which after 50k miles apparently you can start to hear knock on start up where the oil needs to get around them. it's because they are trying to get the crank to run as free as they can and pushed the limits. My friend is a mechanic and just re-built his own M5 and the bearings were really worn at 72k.

    Point being, that I think all products are different with different design parameters. All I know is that it's not just about engines it's about bedding in wheel bearings, brakes, tyres and not having customers firing off down the road and ending up in a mess at the end
     
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  5. Something like 300v is not ideal for breaking in an engine but mega once the motor is.

    One of the best men to speak to would be big brad at powerslide.
     
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  6. I thought a semi synth was best for running in, then fully synth.
     
  7. a few threads on here would disagree with that.......:eyes:
     
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  8. Allow me to rephrase.

    It should be a piece of cake... but take in to account the human element ?

    how’s that?
     
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  9. yep, my mate binned his 25 mile old Aprillia which probably wouldn't have happened with less leather brakes and bedded in tyres. (so he says)
     
  10. ah "should", one of my most favourite words!
     
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  11. always makes me laugh that.

    my brakes get a lap or two at most to bed in and tyres come straight off the warmers to full tilt pretty much.

    human error in my opinion :joy:
     
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  12. Oh i have pointed this out, many many times, but nope, definitely the lethal new brakes and tyres!
     
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  13. When I am not posting in here :D I often watch american car programmes and I've noticed that if they rebuild the engine, they have a break in sequence specifically to "harden up the crank and crank lobes? but if they have a brand new from the manufacturer crate engine they just bang it in and then have at it.
     
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  14. What do they know :D
     
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  15. That makes sense, he was a tosser though
     
  16. When i ran my hyper evo 1100 in i was quite aggressive apart from below 3000 & above 7000, probly using 3/4 throttle in short bursts up through the gears the easing off for a mile or 2.
    It now has 54k miles on the clock, uses no oil has no rattles & makes no less power than before, did have to have exhaust guides at 40k though. Castrol synthetic oil every 4k.
    Also had 2 honda nc750's, they got full beans from day one...
     
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  18. I'm apparently an engineer but not a good one, have had bike race engines built that in the right hands have set outright circuit records in the uk in (Cars) much longer @ full throttle and potential for abuse... have to be strong to last a season. Mine did not use oil... although oil was replaced after every race weekend. I did run one (unknown history race engine that had been raced prior more than one 1 1/2 season and spent no money on it) it was still going strong when I pulled it out...

    Was always told, run in on mineral oil, up to temp then dump it out. Fully, has addatives in that prevents things from bedding in, as these engine builders want it to... honed cylinders and new rings. I do not know if it is true are the rings softer? and get harder with use vs inital 1st start up (do not want them glazing or polishing the bores?) but there was always some suggestion that the motor is not just run gentle (1st time) at tick over, low revs. Make sure it has oil pressure, which takes a while to get it to prime (we had oil p gauge). Then as it warms up, give it some progressive throttle for happy rings and bores. Too late once it has been run in.

    As Ads said, we often changed oil at the track/paddock doing this.

    We did run at certain revs, on 1st test day (4 or so 15-20 min session)... giving it a few heat cycles before max power. Having a look for loose bolts, oil leaks and horrible noises, but then on to the dyno. I have seen people driving round the paddock following an engine swap at a race weekend, not the way I would like to do it but... Some engine builders like BSD I think do break them in on a dyno. Which skips some of that process.

    I do not about road bikes. < I think Triumph run them all up? & I can find out from the guys who do know.

    Our (race) motors had never been run, so were just lightly coated with oil or lube from the build, bit different if it's been through that process.

    I recall the race engine builders I used, also made a bit of fuss about new cranks with, big ends, and con rod bolts. I guess as things get warm they expand, so warm it up and give it a chance... not to spin a bearing or ? I guess it is just being cautious, as the tolerances are there, lubrication is there. If it is going to go, it will regardless when it is given the big one...

    I was told by one engine builder I used, with many championship winning engines anyone can build an engine, and in a road bike one not built so well might last a long time, but on track at good pace... to be reliable, that is different. Mine were not standard. Did not run balance shafts, and other such... but they were doing 1.21's round Cadwell in a 400kg chassis/fuel/pilot.

    I have mates who work in motogp and F1 but never really discussed it with them.
    I've been in the F1 dynos but don't know what they do. I do know of a bike engine designer, I could ask what they do. I think he said they run all their bikes in.

    One of my engines was built by a top 10 road racer (who was replaced by M dunlop) and some of that advice above was from him, having been involved with well known teams.

    I have no idea, I just do as advised.

    And I recall they were not too keen on rev'in the tits off an unloaded engine in neutral.
    Not sure if that is because the tolderances are reduced (racing) with increased compression and valve timing changes.. my view they do at race starts to an extent, and they rev high when loaded, but obviously they rev faster with no load.
     
    #78 Not Carl Fogarty, Feb 8, 2020
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2020
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  19. Never started a motor after oil/filter change without 1st turning over in 2nd gear with plugs out untill oil light goes off. Bit anal? maybe but gives me piece of mind.
     
  20. Not anal. Without an oil pressure gauge it's best practice. Low mileage bikes in the garage for months can have a sticking pump, dry bores and or rings. Takes a few minutes to check saves a fortune in strip down. Quite normal with bike collectors with investment bikes to do just that.
     
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